/tg/Station 13

Bottom post of the previous page:

Circuits are going to be replacing R&D pretty soon here with the techwebs merge and decentralization of R&D, and right now, why would I bother making anything complex if I can't save my work?

Things that can happen without the ability to back my work up:
"oh, rev/gang/wizard/cult/clockcult/nuke round just ended 15 minutes in, RIP my design I was halfway through building, no way to back it up before round restarts"
"hey check out this cool logic module I made to use in other configurations, too bad I can't save it and reuse the technology elsewhere"
"here's an example on how to set up locomotion, oh wait, I can't give you the design"


Potential issues:
"people will spam stun bots!"
we nerf the stunner/make it traitor only
"people will spam the same bots over and over again and wont improve their design"
they already do

Incomptinence wrote:Printing would be fine if the robots took damage from being attacked and parts were gated behind resource input other than pure iron.

Roundstart materials and you can make some pretty dreadful people seeking pneumatic cannon bots I am fairly sure no nades or guns required.

Some fuck just running around turning everything but the plating into damage immune killbots 10 minutes in if we allow scripting with things as they are.

IIRC the only thing we allow cross-round storage and printing for is books.

Incomptinence wrote:Printing would be fine if the robots took damage from being attacked and parts were gated behind resource input other than pure iron.

Roundstart materials and you can make some pretty dreadful people seeking pneumatic cannon bots I am fairly sure no nades or guns required.

Some fuck just running around turning everything but the plating into damage immune killbots 10 minutes in if we allow IC printing with things as they are.

Good one, when did this happen

Additionally you know you can just pick them up and stuff them in your backpack to disarm them right

Does that really make much sense as a rock hard stance when dealing with a new feature though?

iamgoofball wrote:

Incomptinence wrote:Printing would be fine if the robots took damage from being attacked and parts were gated behind resource input other than pure iron.

Roundstart materials and you can make some pretty dreadful people seeking pneumatic cannon bots I am fairly sure no nades or guns required.

Some fuck just running around turning everything but the plating into damage immune killbots 10 minutes in if we allow IC printing with things as they are.

Good one, when did this happen

Additionally you know you can just pick them up and stuff them in your backpack to disarm them right

It hasn't yet because as you said the process is laborious and crippled at present.

Also wouldn't kitting the resulting wounded crew be easy for a throw bot?

Then if we go to anything slightly more advanced than roundstart stuff that "counter" to IC droids would probably just lead to you having a primed grenade in your backpack.

Incomptinence wrote:Does that really make much sense as a rock hard stance when dealing with a new feature though?

What did he mean by this

cedarbridge wrote:

Incomptinence wrote:Printing would be fine if the robots took damage from being attacked and parts were gated behind resource input other than pure iron.

Roundstart materials and you can make some pretty dreadful people seeking pneumatic cannon bots I am fairly sure no nades or guns required.

Some fuck just running around turning everything but the plating into damage immune killbots 10 minutes in if we allow scripting with things as they are.

IIRC the only thing we allow cross-round storage and printing for is books.

So what here actually replies to the quote aside from repeating the same story because you're a fucking disgrace to debate?

I was responding to cedar and you posted while I did so.

Cedar's stance basically falls to bits when you realise some goober is just going to copy everything they input themselves to a separate document then scribble a diagram somewhere for the wiring.

Out of game tools again just like telescience!

Incomptinence wrote:I was responding to cedar and you posted while I did so.

Cedar's stance basically falls to bits when you realise some goober is just going to copy everything they input themselves to a separate document then scribble a diagram somewhere for the wiring.

Not really. The wiki is full of listings of the things needed to make various chem compounds. It would save time immensely if I could just press 4 buttons to make meth instead of 12+. It would save even more time if I could skip the base components and just press "meth" because I figured out the things I needed last time and I'd rather cut out the busywork of making the thing and just print a beaker of meth. Drawing up a diagram somewhere does not produce a bot in-game. Nobody's asking you to relearn the system required to make circuits every round. They are expecting you to start from zero like everyone else in a round and work from nothing to create something. That means you don't get to just turn to the page you left a book mark on and forge on like the last round was still going.

"But circuits take too long for that. I'll never get anywhere in a round without a shortcut."
Then you have a shitty circuits system that is too involved and slow to fit into the game in its current form and adding cross-round storage is a bandaid on a bigger design issue.

Incomptinence wrote:Out of game tools again just like telescience!

Telesci was removed and space ruin locations were randomized. I'm not sure your point.

Data input makes for a bad time gate.

Someone will manage to optimise it without IC_Printing.

Just a word, the few persistent features we have are special BECAUSE they are an exception to the standard, using them to disprove the existence of that standard isn't valid.

how are we still arguing about this has this even been a problem over the last few weeks?

As far as i can see, ICs have two timesgates: finding the right way to program them, and actually doing it. The former carries between rounds already, you can take notes yourself. IC_Printing would get rid of the latter, which is currently slow due to a fairly unfriendly UI.

The problem here in my opinion is that there is no other timegate to circuits; materials are extremely cheap, the research to start circuiting is available early on and unlocks everything at once, components are printed instantly. Make the materials, especially the abusable stuff, have additional costs, either from research or materials, and minute one killbots will be much less of a problem.

are people actually making the minute one killbots though or are you people crying wolf

Ahem. So now assemblies will be damageable.
Later I'll link printer to techwebs. So for advanced machines you'll need advanced tech.

Anout material cost I'll think about it

Selea wrote:Anout material cost I'll think about it

There's a reason science stuff is locked behind it, stops people immediately spamming the top tier stuff until the miners get in.

Doesn't do much for long if you have one competent person to do each job but it stops roundstart being a clusterfuck.