/tg/Station 13

A spaceship survival simulation doesn't need to give said disasters plenty of weaknesses to exploit does it?

The truth:

The reason it needs to be balanced is not because it needs to be balanced per se, but because every time someone finds something imbalanced in the game they abuse it over and over 50 shifts in a row until the coding team has to step in to nerf it because people won't stop abusing it.

Imitates-The-Lizards wrote: ↑Sat Nov 11, 2023 6:37 am The reason it needs to be balanced is not because it needs to be balanced per se, but because every time someone finds something imbalanced in the game they abuse it over and over 50 shifts in a row until the coding team has to step in to nerf it because people won't stop abusing it.

This. If we didn't have a population of players who treated the game like a competitive esport we could get away with way less balance.

Imitates-The-Lizards wrote: ↑Sat Nov 11, 2023 6:37 am The reason it needs to be balanced is not because it needs to be balanced per se, but because every time someone finds something imbalanced in the game they abuse it over and over 50 shifts in a row until the coding team has to step in to nerf it because people won't stop abusing it.

This summarizes it well. It's a running thing on Livrah videos that "the mean coders nerf fun " when it's only really fun for the person doing it. See Livrah as a wizard casting rod form every few seconds and it gets to the point that the crew is just begging him to stop.

also it would put an enormous strain on the admin team if we didnt' get involved.

RedBaronFlyer wrote: ↑Sat Nov 11, 2023 8:44 pm

Imitates-The-Lizards wrote: ↑Sat Nov 11, 2023 6:37 am The reason it needs to be balanced is not because it needs to be balanced per se, but because every time someone finds something imbalanced in the game they abuse it over and over 50 shifts in a row until the coding team has to step in to nerf it because people won't stop abusing it.

This summarizes it well. It's a running thing on Livrah videos that "the mean coders nerf fun " when it's only really fun for the person doing it. See Livrah as a wizard casting rod form every few seconds and it gets to the point that the crew is just begging him to stop.

This is why Livrah haunts the github downvoting basically every good PR that gets posted

Wahh wahh wahh the crew is begging him to stop because he figured out a cool combo.

There will always be broken features, coders can cope but it won't matter. Give up balance and embrace the jank.

The solution should be randomness. The options to get powerful things should change every round so it can't be abused every time.

Something OP appearing every 20 rounds is fun, something OP appearing every round is not.

Maxcaps exist so SS13 is never really balanced.

sinfulbliss wrote: ↑Sun Nov 12, 2023 6:55 am Wahh wahh wahh the crew is begging him to stop because he figured out a cool combo.

There will always be broken features, coders can cope but it won't matter. Give up balance and embrace the jank.

broken combos are fun until its recorded and the next 50 players who get wizard do the same thing

We do it to annoy you specifically

It's a player issue. People need to stop playing for only their enjoyment

There have been things in this games history that were both broken and used to inflict harm to other players on a mass scale that it stopped being fun, like nanites. Those should be balanced. Then there are things that are broken that were not used to inflict harm to other players on that scale, like nerfing space adaption for Genetics. The new system they implemented has rendered genetics a shell of itself and it's no longer nearly as useful as a job/department as it once was.

This'll be a bit spicy, but I remember back when a coder/maintainer/whoever from Goon was pulling their hair out over people making bombs out of chips and soda and whatever they could scrape up around the server. Honestly, embrace the bizarre, broken things of SS13 but obviously make people work for it. I've always found the most enjoyable shifts being the ones where we make a groundbreaking discovery that everyone can laugh at or greentext about how absurd it is after. It's what keeps SS13's soul and keeps people talking about it. Balancing everything removes that element of absurdity.

Fikou wrote: ↑Tue Nov 14, 2023 2:41 am

sinfulbliss wrote: ↑Sun Nov 12, 2023 6:55 am Wahh wahh wahh the crew is begging him to stop because he figured out a cool combo.

There will always be broken features, coders can cope but it won't matter. Give up balance and embrace the jank.

broken combos are fun until its recorded and the next 50 players who get wizard do the same thing

This. The problem with any given meta combo isn't necessarily that it's a combo, it's that it's a meta.
The thing about blind meta-followers though is that they get mcfucked incredibly harshly by any changes in how things work, because they learned all their tricks by copying guides and youtubers rather than figuring out why the guides and youtubers did it that way.

It's really funny in games like elite where people want the "best farming site" and wonder why they get fucked when the really lucrative settlement they learned about from a let's play changes hands and is now controlled by an imperial dictatorship that's putting a price on their heads instead of some random pirate gang that you can just blow away without legal consequence, and they throw a tantrum on the forums about the farming grounds getting nerfed because they never learned how to find these spots for themselves.

balance is impossible but there absolutely needs to be a focus in terms of design

TG has no focus code wise and I have no idea what focus we would even want

removing prog-traitor

knightlyeli wrote: ↑Fri Nov 17, 2023 6:51 am This'll be a bit spicy, but I remember back when a coder/maintainer/whoever from Goon was pulling their hair out over people making bombs out of chips and soda and whatever they could scrape up around the server. Honestly, embrace the bizarre, broken things of SS13 but obviously make people work for it. I've always found the most enjoyable shifts being the ones where we make a groundbreaking discovery that everyone can laugh at or greentext about how absurd it is after. It's what keeps SS13's soul and keeps people talking about it. Balancing everything removes that element of absurdity.

I should make ghetto chem bombs and make a video about it causing people to make lots of ghetto chem bombs.